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Had drying problems with F&B estate eggshell?


#1

I’m not a big fan of F&B paints at all, but if the customer wants it I will use it. (I do try to talk them out of it if I can)

The last time I used it was on a ready to paint kitchen, so no need for any undercoat. Got to say it was not easy to use, I found it very heavy and hard to lay off.

But did find with the use of Floetrol it did seem to work a bit better, but then I was finding the drying times were getting silly.

Touch dry in 2-3 hrs but even the next day it felt very soft and had a plastic feel to it, which when de-nibbing didn’t look of feel right, so ended up giving it another 24 hrs before re-coating.

Would not be in a hurry to use again and will try even harder next time to talk the customer round to going with Little Green, top paint and just love the finisn.


#2

Not sure what primer it was, but will try to find out next week.

I did also do on the same job two 6 panel doors for them, which I primed with zin 1-2-3 and then the eggshell on that.
Got to say that did dry better than the units, and was fine the following day for a de-nib with 320 paper.

So it might be the primer on the units but will have to try out a few little tests before I can say either way.

I have a few old units and doors at home, (ready to paint) so will try another one onto the primer and another with a coat of 1-2-3 one to see if that works better.

Will let you know as soon as I do it, (hopefully Monday / Tuesday)


#3

“Here’s an update from Colin Taylor about the F&B estate eggshell experience over water-based factory primer.
1 coat u/c and 2 eggshell, so replacing one eggshell with an u/c, but of course it means buying an extra tin of paint.”

OK but when using eggshell, to get the best out of it and to get its best “luster finish” I was always told to apply two coats of eggshell, as its self undercoating and will not get to its true finish with one coat.

This is the method I have been using for the last 30yrs, so are they now saying one undercoat and one eggshell will give the same finish as two top coats ??


(Colour republic) #4

Yeah as you know I’ve recently had an issue with the Estate Eggshell with regards to curing.

System used was

1 x Zinsser Coverstain
1 x Diluted (5%-10%ish) F&B Under/Primer
1 x F&B Under/Primer
2 x F&B Estate Eggshell

No problems with the undercoat drying but the eggshell whilst touch dry within 45/60 mins it stayed tacky for maybe 2-3 days. Not tacky in the sense that dust would stick or if you picked it up would leave finger prints but just felt tacky to the touch. Much like sticky residue left when removing an old sticker.

The problems came when stacking the doors edge to edge (I know you use this system too sometimes Andy as seen a picture on this website somewhere) When 2 tacky edges were stacked against each other sometimes the paint would come off onto the other door. Only small marks but very annoying.

Surprisingly I only noticed this when doing the doors but then I don’t suppose I had much reason to handle the frames after they were painted. Sanding between coats didn’t seem to be much of an issue even when the doors were tacky, it didn’t clog the paper but then finishing paper rarely does.

So all in all just quite weird, the paint had dried but just a strange tackyness for a few days after.


(Carte Blanche) #5

Just sprayed it yesterday…beautiful, beautiful and hard as nails with little air movement in the room


(Colour republic) #6

Was thinking about this about again last night.

Another odd thing that may or may not be related. On the job in question when I washed the brushes out they rinsed out clear quite easily but then the bristles felt claggy after, no amount of rinsing seemed to get rid off it. Gave them a rinse with washing-up liquid but still no improvment. So I gave them a quick twirl in brush restorer (slight over kill but at least the cleaner is water soluble) and the brushes were restored.

At first I put this down to the brush itself. It was the first time I was trying out the Picasso’s and I had run them under warm water. I thought maybe the warm water had reacted with a resin holding the bristles in. So the next time I washed them in cold water but the same thing happened and had to reach for the restorer.

Having now used the brushes with various types of paint (masonry, VM, WB trim, etc etc…) I’ve not had the problem again, so now I can only assume something in the paint wasn’t water soluble. I’m no paint chemist but it seems after rinsing the carrier and pigment out I was left with some sort of binder that didn’t break down. It seems a coincedence that after washing I was left with a sticky residue and also once the paints had started to dry I was also left with a sticky residue??

Be interested to see if you guys had problems washing the brushes too. From memory I think this happened with both the primer and the eggshell but can’t be 100% certain as I wasn’t playing too much attention but I do know I got through 2 bottles of brush restorer on that job so assume it happened with both.


(Carte Blanche) #7

Maybe because it is alkyd…perhaps no surprise. Normally it works out in cold water but we always rinse with washing up liquid. I am convinced this is a humidity issue…but I also reckon this is a batch issue.
Has anyone yet actually spoken with the tech guys at F&B?..I have yet to actually speak to a single paint technology person


(Colour republic) #8

I know i posted this in 2 different places Cait, so overlapping somewhat. Sorry

I think it’s either a batch issue or formulation change, the later F&B deny.

The washing out issue. My first port of call was washing-up liquid, I then tried KK (sprayed on) both with little success. It was only the restorer that shifted it. Again don’t remember having to do that before and assumed it wasn’t down to the paint but now having used the brush in plenty of other paints I have to say the F&B wseems the likely cause


(Carte Blanche) #9

I think it has to be a batch issue because we have had no problem for the last 3 jobs and as I said we sprayed a REALLY heavy layer on a table top and it dried HARD overnight and I mean really hard.


#10

Right, just done a kitchen in London using F&B eggshell which is the first time in a while.

Drying times were spot on, in fact if you needed to you could rub down / de-nib the same day, it was not a warm room but paint was touch dry in under 40 min’s.

I had two test pieces (an old door) and was testing them through out the day for feel and dryness and was very happy with both.

I de-nibbed one door with a 320 pad just 3 hours after coating it up and it was fine and sanded nicely ( I wouldn’t recommend do this it was only for testing )

Now I must say I have never been a big fan of F&B paints, but will say this time I got on with it very well and was more than happy with the finish, as was the customer ( nice little 6 bottles of red for making her kitchen some wonderful )

Not sure what they have done to the paint but it worked.

Merry Christmas to you all and hope you all have a great time.

Neil