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New job, new system?


(Holty) #1

Hello everybody.
Happy new year to you all and thanks for all the advice last year. So, I have started to try and do things the TP way and tried out a system suggested here for a loft conversion that I have just done. I used the Dulux WB primer/undercoat and the Dulux WB QD gloss on all the wood work. Loved the primer/undercoat but had some trouble keeping up with the wet edge when using the gloss - especially on the architrave/door liner/doorstop bit!
Anyway, I’ve got another loft to do so I was hoping to try out a different system and would appreciate any suggestions for :
Paint system for new bare timber trim/existing painted trim (one system for both?)
Emulsion for new plaster walls/existing painted walls
(Cut in with brush and mini roller all the way around edges of one wall and then fill in with big roller?)
Also basic sequences for decorating such a space ie start here, do that next and do this bit last!
And specific sequences for things like architrave/doorliner/doorstop.
Also I saw a post which recommended some wooster rolling kit but can’t find it now.

PS I am going to look at this job on Tuesday so won’t know what finishes are required until then.
My mate built the loft conversion and reckons I’m getting the job. I appreciate that you might not want to contribute to this unless the job is confirmed. No worried there. Always grateful for any comments.

Lee.


(Holty) #2

Just seen the job and the plastering and carpentry is going to make my job a tad more difficult! So, got a bit of extra filling to do. The client wants white emulsion (she has already bought this) on the walls and ceilings and eggshell or satinwood on the woodwork.
Handrails to be stained to match existing and spindles and newel posts in white.
I have some easifill and prestonett multipurpose filler on board and some Filltite 2 part wood filler. Need to get some caulk and probably some different fillers?
Looks like I’ve got some tricky painting to do on the stairs so any advice on prep and order of work will go down a treat.
Also looking to upgrade my kit so:
Brushes for stairs (I have a set of silver Fox’s and a 2.5" & 3" Picasso.
Roller kit - I think all my sleeves need to go apart from my Axus lime green ones! I saw the Pelican kettle on here which looked quite handy.
Filling and sanding kit.
Thanks guys.

Got the job so, full steam ahead TP style! (I hope!)


(claytondecorating) #3

Hi, Lee!

I personally love the Wooster scuttle and kettle range. I have the wideboy scuttle and the Wooster 4 gallon scuttle too. I have lids for them both. You can buy both with lids for about £35 inc VAT. Both extremely well built.
The pelican is a great little addition too. Worth a buy.

The original fox brush bundle on MPB (www.mypaintbrush.co.uk) is on sale at the moment! Excellent brushes in both water and solvent paints.

The fox mini sleeves have great ratings, I personally haven’t used them but Russ said to me they are really good. If you are looking for a 9 inch sleeve or bigger, again I’d go with Wooster. It’s personal choice but for me they have lasted the longest whilst performing to the highest standard everytime and remaining like new for the longest.

I hope this helps you!


(greenpainting) #4

Hi Lee. Not sure I can remember all you were asking but I’ll stick in a few things that might help.

If you are using WB paints (which everyone should be) you will find you lose the wet edge much quicker. W/B paint isn’t the same as Oil made differently. It’s a different beast and it needs a different approach. For me the method I have found works best is to do as little as possible with the paint once it’s on. Get it on, spread it once, lay it off. Then leave it. Don’t keep messing about trying to spread it further and don’t put it on too thin. Some brushes are better for this than others but it’s a case of what works for you. Just don’t try going back to a painted section after a couple of minutes to try and brush out drips. Wait till the drip is still wet but the rest of the paint has almost skinned over and use a wet finger to smooth it. Then be more careful so you don’t get more drips :wink:

You need to sit and plan you work before you start. You’ll be surprised how much time you save when you write down what your sequence will be so you don’t waist time standing about trying to decide what to do next. Think logically. Work from top to bottom so you don’t mess up what you’ve already done while you work over it. Don’t end up sitting waiting for paint to dry - plan for things to do in that time.

Painting walls - you know about keeping wet edges right? Difficult when you’re cutting in with a brush and roller - by the time you come to use the big roller your edges have started drying. You’re better to plan so you cut in on one day and do the main rolling the day after when your edges are completely dry. The problems are usually from painting over edges that are neither wet nor properly dry. Some paints are worse than others but I’ve never had problems when I’ve let the edges dry first. If you work like that you won’t feel you need to rush your cutting in so much - less pressure.

Some people like to paint the skirting before the walls. That’s fine if it works for you but make sure you use the right tape to mask them over fresh paint and make sure you are using paint you can trust to stay on the wood when you take the tape off!

Look at the pros and cons of scuttle v. tray. It can depend on the kind of jobs you’re doing but I prefer trays - I find them faster to load with and cleaner. Some people find the opposite so put some thought into it before you start spending. Tray liners can work out expensive and I’ve recently started using the sticky floor protection film to line trays with and it works fine.

Sure I’ve missed some things but every little helps right? :smile:

Cheers
Andy


(darlic) #5

Will give the sticky floor protection a go on my big ben tray, thanks for the tip.cheers


(darlic) #6

floetroll I use all the time helps keep the wet edge longer.


(greenpainting) #7

Takes a bit of work to get the sticky stuff in the tray but once you work it out it’s easy enough. Just remember it doesn’t matter if you get folds and creases because it’s all going to stick to itself anyway.

Floetrol seems to work for some people but be careful not to become addicted to it. Some people throw it in everything but not all paint needs it. I decided a while back that the alternative to using extenders was to change the way I put the pant on. I never use it now but never have problems with open times either. I’m moving away from acrylic paints so it’s not much use to me anyway now :slight_smile:


(Holty) #8

Hello Claytondecorating!
Have got my eye on a set those Foxes now and a pelican. Thinking about the 14" wooster roller (can’t remember the name of it) that I read about on here somewhere along with the 4 1/2 jumbo kota. For the large size roller would suggest a pro dooz?
Thanks for your post,
Lee.


(Holty) #9

Hello Andy,
So maybe give the same trim paint system another go and do things a little differently? Just to give me an idea, when painting the architraves and door frames for example, how long a stroke would you get when applying the WB gloss over WB primer/UC (as used on my last job)? I think I was getting about 150mm and I was working from the edge of the architrave round to the doorstop and working my way down. Also, are there any good clips of someone doing this so I can get an idea of the pace and timing I should be aiming for?
Interesting bit about letting the cuts dry out completely - the bloke I work with always got me to try keep up with the wet paint! So, would you cut with just the brush and then use the big roller the next day or would you get a mini roller involved? I’ve been using brush, mini roller, big roller one after the other completing one wall at a time with inconclusive results.
Sticky floor protection to line your roller trays? Genius! I’ll be having some of that!
Thanks a bunch Andy.

Darlic - I have had those additives on my radar for a while and think I’ll try some on this next job.
Thanks for the tip


(greenpainting) #10

The length of stroke really is dependent on the brush you use and how you load it. The open time you have depends on the paint product and the temp/humidity of the room. So what I get is not necessarily going to be what you get. I don’t work the way other people might and the way I paint might make other experienced painters cringe/laugh/spit out their tea.

However, lets assume I am painting a bit of door trim. I load the brush. Now my method now is to load about half way up the brush but I don’t do the tap out that most decs seem to do. I wipe one side. Remember the brush is loaded with paint inside anyway. So the un-wiped side I apply working down and increasing pressure the further the stroke goes - and I am going to put about 30cm on the wood. Then I’ll either put the brush back above the point I started and spread down again to even out the paint before laying off upwards from the end of the stroke and into the previous stroke. That’s it - don’t touch that section again. Depending on the paint and the area you are painting you can even miss the second downward stroke which means you simply apply and spread downwards and then lay off with a single up stroke. The trick is knowing how heavy to put the paint on so you get maximum coverage and minimum risk of runs and drips. I know a lot will spend more time spreading and laying off but with the right paint thinned to the right consistency you’ll find the less you touch it, the better it will level off with minimal brush marks. This is something you need to work at and you will find your own method and your own brush/paint preference.

Working door frames I generally work from the top down and paint the whole frame rather than going in strips and coming back to the top. But you do need to work fast to make sure you’re always laying off into wet paint.

Best tip is to buy yourself a few lengths of trim and experiment with different brushes and methods to see what works. Don’t take what other decorators tell you as being the only and best way. Use logic. You know what you need to achieve as a result so work through how to get it. Getting it wrong is the fastest way to find out the best way.

Walls - generally the reason people use a mini is to keep the roller texture going as close to the edge as possible. That does work and it makes the brush cuts less noticable but it also adds to the work time. Some people have problems with ‘framing’ where the edge stands out against the rest when the paint has dried. I’m not convinced this is a paint problem though. I think more often it’s that we sometimes put less paint on by brush than we do with a roller. So when we’ve finished the paint is a bit thinner round the edge. So the obvious solution is to get a good coat of paint on when you cut the edges. If you’re worried about going like the clappers to get it done so you can roll while edges are wet, then you are likely to put the paint on too thin. So plan to roll the walls the next day - or at least after a few hours - and concentrate on getting a good thick coat on the cuts with the brush. BUT feather the edge where you’re going to be lapping with the roller otherwise you will see a line. If you’re working with a mini that’s less of a problem but it can still show in the final finish if you leave a heavy edge.

Brush cut, mini roller, big roller - one wall at a time? I have worked that way but it’s so messy and I don’t think very effective. While you’re doing your big roll on your brush and mini roller are sitting there going dry and vice versa.


(Holty) #11

Thanks again Andy, great post. I am going to print these off and keep them in a folder!
Spit out their tea? Imagine what they’d do if they saw me in action!


(darlic) #12

When we started andy recommended the pro dooze rollers,execllent i bought the whole kit that’s recommended on here under Wooster kit how to paint walls, this you can really push to the limits, so impressed ,I bought my son one you fall in love once you use them, if your looking for good clips on painting I suggest jack pauhl,exellent videos,you can see the smoke come off the brush he,s so fast and good.cheers goodluck with your job jason


(Holty) #13

Thanks Jason. I think that’s what I’m going to go for (a wooster roller kit), did you get the 14" and the 4 1/2 jumbo Kota? And did you get a tray or scuttle?
Cheers,
Lee.


(Andy Crichton) #14

You can bookmark all the good ones, (if you want to save a small forest :slight_smile: )


(Holty) #15

Ha ha - thanks Andy!
It’s not easy being technologically disadvantaged you know.


(darlic) #16

yes ,and big ben tray, if you type in how to paint walls with Wooster roller kit,its all there,cheers


(Holty) #17

Nice one. Thanks Jason.


(markjuk) #18

Worth considering getting one or two Kovrd paint tray storage bags:

http://www.mypaintbrush.co.uk/accessories/kovrd-paint-tray-storage

They will take a Big Ben tray.


(Andy Crichton) #19

Here’s the pics to show what you can fit in a Kovrd


(Holty) #20

The list gets bigger and bigger…Thanks mark!

Thanks Andy - Gotta get me one of those!