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Redecorating Crittal Windows


(DavidJ) #1

Hi,

I went out yesterday to look at what will hopefully be my big Spring job. Big old lodge house, middle of nowhere, husband works in property development in London so obviously knows his stuff, not short of a bob or two and wants it all done properly: “not worried about time, I want a quality job with Dulux products”. All well and good.

Compared to most guys on here, I will be a relatively inexperienced decorator, 38 and only been going five years, so I know I have lots to learn. To be honest, I do enjoy decorating, but I get bored with it sometimes (although I’m sure everyone does). I often find I’m not sure of how to approach a particular problem, but take my best guess based on common sense. It usually works out as I’m reasonably sensible. I have some great feedback on Checkatrade and pretty much all of my customers are happy with what I do and how I work.

But I get the distinct feeling I’ve reached a plateau and am not learning anything new, which I’m finding frustrating. I work mostly on my own, which probably explains a lot of that!

My point is, it’s time to up my game and take it a bit more seriously, or I’ll end up going crazy.

So I’m intending to dig a bit deeper into some of my jobs, I’ve already had some good advice on here (thank you Andy) but I’d like some more, especially to help me put together a comprehensive quote for this outside next year.

First thing I’m curious about is the Crittal windows. Last set of these I did were in an awful state, hadn’t been done in years. I scraped them back, sanded down hard, spot primed with Dulux Metalshield Water-based (non-ferrous) Primer then went over with two coats of Dulux Metalshield oil-based in Satin.

They looked pretty good, as you can see. But now I’m wondering, did I do the right thing? I’ve read the article on here about painting galvanised surfaces and I admit I’m a bit confused. Phosphate primer? Zinc primer? Taking all the topcoat off?? Is that necessary (or even possible unless I spend weeks doing it?)?

So I’m after a bit of guidance. Is there anything wrong with the approach I took? I saw a mention of wire brush, wire wool then wet/dry to take all the topcoat off (why wet/dry, are you supposed to use water?). How do I know if I need to use a zinc or phosphate primer, or whether the windows need etching first?

For this job I looked at, the paint on the windows looked generally pretty intact, so I’d guess that taking all the topcoat off would be unnecessary? Sand for a key, then two coats of Metalshield (incidentally, has anyone any experience of using Krudkutter Glossoff instead of sanding?).

What I did notice is that, on frames where the paint wasn’t intact, the black gloss has flaked off in large pieces. Going by what I have read, would this suggest a frame that wasn’t properly primed, so the gloss hasn’t stuck well?

Sorry if this is a bit rambly. What I’m basically after is sound advice on how to properly assess which products and processes to use and recommend to my customer. Because if it’s going to be costly, I’ll have to justify it and need to know what I’m talking about.

Many thanks in advance for any advice offered, but be warned I will probably just ask more questions!


(Andy Crichton) #2

http://traditionalpainter.com/painting-galvanised-surfaces will answer your questions. Remove complete strips or panels that are failing. degrease, then Zinc phosphate primer or zinc chromate primer on bare metal plus conventional topcoats.

I will bow to the Dulux select guys for an A to Z on metal shield. I liked it . A modern hammerite with none of the horrendous negatives. I used it to redec over itself, so can’t say I’m an authority on using it in this situation.

Wet n dry wet is the way to matt down a glossy surface and clean at same time. Or wash down with krudkutter before dry sanding.

Gloss off works but may be best advised to sand first because it won’t de nib , but gives a stronger key. It is also worth tweeting with john at crittal windows. Any more help just ask.

You have a lifetime of years of learning Ahead and shouldn’t be getting bored after 5 years! This is probably the most disruptive time in decorating with new products. So lots to get on top of


(DavidJ) #3

[quote]Quote from Andy Crichton on December 9, 2012, 17:09
http://traditionalpainter.com/painting-galvanised-surfaces will answer your questions. Remove complete strips or panels that are failing. degrease, then Zinc phosphate primer or zinc chromate primer on bare metal plus conventional topcoats.

I will bow to the Dulux select guys for an A to Z on metal shield. I liked it . A modern hammerite with none of the horrendous negatives. I used it to redec over itself, so can’t say I’m an authority on using it in this situation.

Wet n dry wet is the way to matt down a glossy surface and clean at same time. Or wash down with krudkutter before dry sanding.

Gloss off works but may be best advised to sand first because it won’t de nib , but gives a stronger key. It is also worth tweeting with john at crittal windows. Any more help just ask.

You have a lifetime of years of learning Ahead and shouldn’t be getting bored after 5 years! This is probably the most disruptive time in decorating with new products. So lots to get on top of
[/quote]

Andy thanks for your reply.

I did read the article on painting galvanised surfaces, but to me it threw up a lot of questions. It often seems there are many products that basically do the same job, i.e., if zinc phosphate primer is the right product to use on “weathered or pre-treated galvanised steel” (their website), why do they make a quick-drying water-based product? I guess because it’s quick-drying and there, I’ve answered my own question!

What you say re: stripping back just panels or sections that are failing makes sense. No point taking the topcoat off everything if it’s intact and in place, I suppose.

I’ve not used wet and dry paper before, but I’m guessing that if you use it, everything needs wiping off afterwards because there will still be residue left behind. Or I suppose on a sunny day, you could just go straight to degreasing with meths (I don’t know why people degrease with white spirit, which is itself greasy…)

Gloss-off sounds interesting, and might be the most efficient method to use on first floor windows at least, where no-one is going to notice the odd nib. As you can see, I’m looking for the quickest method (so if I used Krudkutter, for example, I’d have to apply it, wash it off, wait for it to dry, dry sand, brush that off then degrease, which all sounds unnecessary if I can use a liquid instead)

Having spent ages researching this, I think I’ve basically come full circle and realised that I was probably pretty close with the last set of windows I did, but there are some new approaches I could consider.